The 'eternal security of the believer'. What do you think about this? The idea that you can lose salvation?

(NOTE: These answers are not presented in a particular order, just in the approximate order that they arrived from our contributors. Feel free to add your comments. If you have a burning question send it to steve@saltshakers.com or if you feel able to answer these type of questions email us to join our panel of "messianic rabbis".)

SANDRA JEFFERY answers ...

We can lose our salvation because God gives us freedom of choice. If I become a Christian, but choose not to follow the teachings of the Bible, and the directing of God’s Holy Spirit, I am no more a Christian than someone who enters a building is a contractor. Everything in life hinges on choice and action. God is not a boundary crosser, and if we decide not to be Christian any longer, or chose not to follow the teachings of Jesus but call ourselves Christian, there is no salvation for us. If I don’t take my medicine for a disease, I am not going to be cured of it. We choose life or death through our own actions.

RABBI JOSEPH KRESEFSKY answers ...

Yeshua tells us, in Yochanon (John) 10:29 – “I give eternal life to them; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand."

With such powerful words written in Scripture, one can then conclude that the only way that one could ever lose their salvation is if they had never really had salvation in the first place. And by this I mean, if you never really had a true relationship with G_d/Yeshua, then you were never really saved. If, when you accepted Jesus/Yeshua as your L_rd and Savior, had been walking out your salvation with fear and trembling, then you are forever saved. If, however, you only received salvation, or answered an alter call, as sort of an insurance policy, and never did anything to strengthen and/or build your relationship with the L_rd, but instead continued on living a sinful life with no repentance, no remorse and no change of heart, then it is questionable as to whether you were really saved in the first place.

Yochanon the Immerser (John the Baptist) had this to say in Matthew 3:8-12 – “Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. And do not think you can say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' I tell you that out of these stones G_d can raise up children for Abraham. The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.”

EVETTE LEWIS answers ...

This is what I was told about the subject:-

Anyone that has heard of Salvation and believes in it, through Yeshua is saved, but anyone who knows Him and has a relationship with Him, then turns his back on Him saying that the Holy Spirit does not exist then loses the right to Salvation.

I believe that Jews are chosen and saved - and this is whether or not they believe in Yeshua, because they are chosen.

In short, if you have a relationship with Hashem, then turn your back on Him, and the Holy Spirit, that ends the relationship, and therefore salvation.Yeshua said He was the Way and the Light, and any believer then is in His loving hands, and He will always be faithful to the believer. At the first light of the first day when you become a believer till the very last day, He is there as your Witness to stand up for you and say you are innocent, because He paid the price in full for your redemption. That means you enter into eternity the moment your heart is given to Him.

Mark 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath ... ... but whosoever shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit hath never forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin: ...

Luke 12:10 Everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but those who blaspheme against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven. ...

BOB DOTY answers ...

Answer: First of all, a person's salvation is strictly between them and God (Phil. 2:12). No other person on this earth has the right to make judgment on another's salvation. Whether or not someone can lose their salvation is completely in God's hands, not ours.

HENRY BRINKMAN answers ...

If you can lose your salvation would not this make GOD a liar? If you lose you’re salvation, you never had it in the first place. The Bible tells us when you believe in Yeshua and His death on the cross, and that GOD raised Him form the dead, you will be saved.

RABBI CRAWFORD answers ...

In the very beginning, the angels fought in heaven as war broke out- 1/3 of the angels followed Lucifer and all of those were cast out. They left their first estate.

Also note that G-d gave Yisra’el a certificate of divorce for her spiritual adultery.

With those two things in mind, my answer would be an emphatic “YES you can lose your salvation”. If the angels in heaven can choose to no longer want heaven and G-d as their Most High, then we too can choose to not be Kingdom citizens. If we commit spiritual adultery, we can be cut off too.

I once heard where someone said- to make everyone go to heaven and worship the L-rd for eternity may be hell for some, and surely uncomfortable for the rest of us. It is an act of ultimate love and kindness to disallow someone into the kingdom.

RABBI GUTMANN answers ...

If you can erase your name from the "Lamb's Book of Life" or take yourself out of Jesus' hand, then maybe! When a person is "born again" as described by Jesus in John 3, it seems inconceivable that He would then let them "die again." What I do think is that some who appear to have "lost their salvation" never had it in the first place. When Hebrews warns about the impossibility of "restoring again to repentance" those who have "trampled under foot" the blood of Jesus, and crucified him afresh, in 2 separate passages (in chapter 6 and 10), in each case the writer EXCLUDES his believing readership in words in one of those instances such as "but we are persuaded of better things concerning you, things that accompany salvation." Similarly a "get out" exists in the other passage.

RABBI MAX answers ...

The doctrine of salvation is one of the most important core doctrines of Christianity and one that is attacked most often. To understand whether salvation can be lost, one must comprehend what salvation is and what the result of being saved is:

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Grace alone)

Titus 3:5-7

Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Rom. 11:6 And if by grace, then it is no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Faith Alone

Rom. 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Rom. 4:4-5 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Christ Alone

Jn. 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Acts 14:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Yeshua did all the work to save us from our sins. This is summed up nicely in what is called the “Roman’s Road”:

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Rom 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Rom 8:1a There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus,

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead thou shalt be saved.

Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Jn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Eph 1:12-14 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory

1 Thes 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

2 Thes 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks always to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

Meaning of Salvation

Salvation really means safety, and comes from the Greek word (sozo) that means “to deliver”.

Concepts of Salvation

1. Salvation is always of the Lord; He is the author and finisher of our faith.

2. Salvation is always from sin. Sin is what puts people into hell. The world has need of a sin-bearer, not just a joy-giver!

3. Salvation involves bringing a man out of sin and making him safe from sin and Satan.

4. Salvation deals with the communication of blessing to the sinner who is restored to God’s favour and lives in God’s presence forever.

5. Salvation is found only in the person of Jesus Christ.

The Process of Salvation

1. God the Father purposed, planned, and provided for our salvation.

2. God the Son procured and secured our salvation.

3. God the Holy Spirit applied our salvation.

The Divine Motivation in Salvation

1. To manifest God’s love (I Jn. 4:7-12).

2. The Father gave the thing He loved the most: His Son.

3. When the Father gave the Son, it was for eternity.

5. To provide eternal life (Jn. 3:16).

6. To enable believers to do good works (Eph. 2:10; Titus 2:14).

7. To provide a way to show forth God’s excellence now (I Pet. 2:9).

8. To provide a way for believers to live with the Lord forever (I Thes.5:10).

9. To manifest God’s grace (Eph. 2:7).

The Importance of Salvation

1. That one may come to a full appreciation of salvation.

2. That one might know the gospel. If there is a plan of salvation, every person must know it.

3. That the lost may be evangelised. The gospel must be preached if men are to be saved.

The Tenses of Salvation

1. Past: From the penalty and guilt of sin (Eph. 2:5, 9; 11 Tim. 1:9: Acts 16:31).

2. Present: From the power of sin in the Christian life (Phil. 2:12, 13;

II Cor. 2:15—being saved; I Cor 15:2—being saved; Phil. 1:6).

3. Future: From the presence of sin, when the Christian will receive the final redemption of his body (I Pet. 1:5; Phil. 3:21).

Man’s Views on Salvation

1. Man initiates salvation; God must continue it (incorrect!)

2. Man both initiates and continues salvation (incorrect!)

3. God both initiates and continues salvation (correct!)

All religions outside Christianity teach salvation through works or various types of litanies and repetitive prayer, etc. Catholicism teaches works salvation, and does not agree with the phrase “by grace alone”.

Cults do not teach salvation by grace alone, but promote some form of work salvation or legalism. JWs, Mormons: Men have work to do if they are to obtain “salvation”, baptism and salvation for the dead. Churches teaching salvation by baptism and charismatic’s or Pentecostals who add a special anointing or extra baptism to salvation.

Any teacher who does not fully present the gospel message of grace in its entirety (Alpha Course, Faith And Prosperity etc...).

When reading the above scriptures it is not possible to see how one can lose what G-d has given. Without making this response to long there are Scriptures that apparently say that salvation can be lost. But that is using the particular scriptures out of their original context – which is warnings to those that profess the truth but do not in reality walk in it. Those that claim to be believers but who are in fact not ratified in true faith. Here are some Scriptures that warn of deceivers and unbelievers coming in to destroy the church.

The following Scripture all relates to those who claim to be a part of God’s body of believers and not from Pagan religions outside the faith. Here are some examples from both the Old Testament and the New:

Jeremiah 5:31

The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?

II Timothy 4:3

For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears

Jeremiah 6:13

For from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest every one dealeth falsely.

II Peter 2:1

But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

Jeremiah 14:14

Then the LORD said unto me, The prophets prophesy lies in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart.

Matthew 7:15

Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Lamentations 2:14

Thy prophets have seen vain and foolish things for thee: and they have not discovered thine iniquity, to turn away thy captivity; but have seen for thee false burdens and causes of banishment.

Matthew 24:11

And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

Micah 2:11

If a man walking in the spirit and falsehood do lie, saying, I will prophesy unto thee of wine and of strong drink; he shall even be the prophet of this people.

Luke 6:26

Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.

Matthew 24:24

For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. (Also Mark 13:22.)

Acts 13:6

And when they had gone through the isle unto Paphos, they found a certain sorcerer, a false prophet, a Jew, whose name was Bar-jesus. (A Jew – not an outsider.)

II Peter 2:1

But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily [secretly] shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

I John 4:1

Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

Jude 3-4

Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness

I Timothy 4:1-2

Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

When the Scriptures which apparently relate to the loss of salvation are put back into the correct context – the issues raised above – one can see that the true believer cannot lose salvation but the believer that is in name only can.

Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers. For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision: Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake. One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies. This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith; Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth. Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

(Titus 1:9-16 KJV)

Test yourselves to discover whether you are true believers: put your own selves under examination. Or do you not know that Jesus Christ is within you, unless you are insincere?

(2 Corinthians 13:5 WNT)

We are asked to check even ourselves to make sure we are actually in the faith to begin with, with all the warnings of deception and the many “gospels” preached today; is it not right to make sure one is in the faith in truth before worrying about losing a salvation that people may not have received in the first place.

Yeshua (Jesus) asked a very important question:

Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?

Who do we say the Messiah is? Is it who He says He is? Or a Jesus we prefer? This is the crux of the - Lose salvation issue!!

Since Jesus asked this question, we need to understand why He asked it. A look at this question will show it is one of the most important questions asked in relation to the Messiah in Scriptures.

Let us look at the context and relationship of this Scripture to others that may not at first glance seem to be important, but are in fact relevant to our salvation and of great importance to our knowledge of, and relationship to, the Messiah.

Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?

When looking at this Scripture, we should, of course, understand it in its context. We must read the preceding and following verses to gain perspective:

Mat 16:11 How is it that ye do not understand that I spake it not to you concerning bread, that ye should beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees?

Mat 16:12 then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.

Mat 16:13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?

Mat 16:14 And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elijah; and others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets.

Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?

Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, that thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Verses 11-13 are explaining and warning against the false teachings they were surrounded by; in this case, the Sadducees and the Pharisees.

He then asks the first of the two important questions: Who does the world say I am?

The world—which, in this case, are those of the Jewish faith, those classed as God’s people—say that he is anything other than the Messiah. Note that it is those within the faith who are rejecting Him as Messiah; it is a warning to us in the church today as much as it was a clear warning to the believers of the time.

Verses 16-18 point out the importance of the realisation that Jesus is the Messiah and this understanding only comes by the Father, whom He gives by and through His Spirit, and it is this faith that is unshakeable and the foundation of our relationship with the living God.

The theme of Jesus’ question is carried on and reiterated many times throughout the New Testament. These warnings are either bypassed or used in an attempt to prove all other denominations wrong. Today it is being taught within the “body of Christ” that as long as “a Jesus” is believed in, all is OK, or that the particular promoted Jesus pampering to the desires of the congregation is the only correct one. The trouble is that there are so many “only correct ones” that we can find it difficult to discern the truth.

The question is at the end of the day – Who do you say Jesus is? Remember 2 Corinthians 13:5 Check yourself before worrying about others, make sure you have faith in the real Yeshua and pass the test or be reprobates, as some translations put it. Many pulpits preach opposing doctrines relating to salvation and to whom Yeshua is – yet they all claim to be led by the Spirit. A house divided against itself will fall (Mark 3:25), therefore not all these teachings can be of G-d.

One cannot lose what one does not have in the first place, yet once received we are promised that none can pluck them (the believer) out of my father’s hand:

And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one.

(John 10:28-30 KJV)