Are you Jewish?

Are you Jewish ... and are you wondering what we are all about?

You can read our online book, A Tapestry of Gefilte Fish or read on ...

How it is possible for Jews to believe in Jesus and remain Jewish and other hot chestnuts ... ?

This is a page for Jewish people, specifically for people who say that you can't be Jewish and believe in Jesus, or who say the same thing but in different ways. On this page we're going to try to answer your questions clearly and, we hope, sensitively. We are not your enemy, we just sincerely believe in what we believe. Just as you do. So please have a look at our brief articles and, if they don't answer your questions, you're free to ask your own questions, anonymously if you like.

I love it!

..."and other hot chestnuts" I was getting a kick! I'm from LI, NY and near NYC, and I really enjoy reading this site! I love all your references, they speak to me:) God Bless, Sheila and Dr. Bruce Hunter:)

What does it mean to be Jewish?

Is Jewish a cultural identity, a religion or ethnic group? If it's cultural or religious than anyone can be Jewish who shares in the ideologies but if it's ethnicity not so.

Are Jewish people a part of Israel or are they Israel _ I believe that this comes up in the 2-house theory of Israel.

As a 'Gentile'follower of the Messiah and one who is trying to understand, learn and teah Hebrew roots to other Christians inc. Sabbath-keeping I find the Gentile & Jews distinction upsetting.

I think it's hard enough for Christians trying to walk in the'ancient ways' without our more mature brothers and sisters providing a further obstacle of 'Jewishness' to overcome.

The scriptures tell me in Isaiah 56 that the Lord binds me to His people and sees no distinction b/w Jew and Gentile.

Sorry to rant on but living in the UK I am yet to find a church/congregation that doesn't make me feel different because of my beliefs.

What does it mean to be Jewish ?

I do not understand this desire to walk in the 'ancient ways'or why any Spirit-filled Believer should imagine it is necessary to teach it to other Christians. It is good to be aware that Christ, the God-man, was of Jewish descent, and that Gentiles are, by the Grace of God, grafted onto the Vine, who is Jesus Christ, but the whole principal of the Faith and of His coming was to demonstrate the Divine Love of God for the world and to unite us, not divide us. I sympathise with any feeling of 'not belonging' in a church - as a true Believer and a Gentile, I have found that I don't fit into any local church either, which is precisely why I serve to the best of my ability through Saltshakers. There have been brilliant English ministers/teachers down the generations, and a clear understanding of that Divine Love, without walls and without rules and without unnecessary and pointless burdens, has been set down by Henry Drummond. First published in 1880 and entitled "The Greatest Thing in the World" It can be downloaded and printed off. It is the pure essence of what the life of every Believer should display. God Bless.
Mustard seed

Because 'The old wine is best'

I rather think the vine is an 'Olive Tree' and the 'Olive Tree' is Isra'el.

Isra'el is the focus of the Bible from Genesis to Revelation - not us Gentiles. We were probably not on the original guest list for the party. We shouldn't forget this and become arrogant - for we have been warned how easily we can be cut off again from the olive tree!!! Do we see arrogance in the churches attitude to Isra'el? - Think we might, just a little bit!

So why the interest in 'the old ways'.

Well firstly, I believe the bible makes it clear that YHWH has not finished with physical Isra'el - there will always be a remnant. This should put the debate about Torah observant Judaism and its relationship to Christianity on the minds of all followers of Yeshua and equally on the minds of observant Jews.
Remember, YHWH, who seems to have been totally relegated to the side lines by mainstream Christianity (although not by His Son when He walked the earth), doesn't change - He is the same One God today as He was throughout the Tanakh and the same One God who will rule at the end of time.

He taught His people the ways He wanted them to behave. Nowhere did Yeshua say this had changed. In fact, He taught just the opposite. The Heavens and Earth are still in existence and if we take a glance at Matthew 5, we can see that this means that the Torah has not been made redundant - Yeshua Himself said this was the case.
So now we have to ask, 'Would YHWH have given imperfect rules to His people'? Doesn't really seem likely to say the least. As an unchanging God, are His views of required behaviour likely to have changed? That is one for you to ask yourself but to me, it seems more than unlikely.

Thus, for Isra'el, what is here being called the 'Old ways' are, according to Yeshua, the Current ways and as such should certainly be studied and taught for, we are also told in Matthew 5, 'Whoever disobeys the least of these mitzvot and teaches others to do so will be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven .....'.

In fact, all the following section of Matthew 5 (The 'You have heard' bits) make no sense whatsoever unless viewed in the context of existing Torah law - Yeshua is correcting false interpretation, He is not destroying the underlying principles.

So is all this relevant to us Gentiles? The biblical answer, seems to be 'Yes'. We, as Gentile believers, formerly strangers and aliens, are now graftees onto the Isra'el rootstock thus forming 'One new creation' - there is 'no difference between Jew and Gentile'.

I know most will shout 'Paul says 'It is all history, everything has changed since Yeshua - just read Galations'. I would agree that, on the surface, it appears he might say this in some places but then in other places he seems to uphold the law - Paul can be a bit difficult to rationalise to say the least.

But assuming for a moment that we arrive at a position where we think that Paul is saying that the law is no longer relevant, how can we make this work with Yeshua's affirmation that He has not come to do away with the law?

I can see only two possible answers to this ...
either there is a conflict between the teachings of Yeshua and Paul
or, as Gentiles living in the 21st century. we just cannot get our heads around the intended message being given in the first century by one or other of the two.

Whichever of these is the case, it seems wise really to follow the teachings of the Master Himself rather than His disciple (the church always seems to do exactly the opposite for some reason I just cannot fathom).

When I survey the church as it now is, I see tremendous presumption - God won't mind us ignoring the Sabbath. God doesn't care about us not following His 'Forever' commands, God won't mind us celebrating Easter(a full on pagan festival) etc. I have had to ask myself 'does this matter'? The Bible suggests it does - big time!! Examples from the Tanakh include 'Abihu and Nadab' and also Nebuchadnezzer. Just in case someone might say that, as well as everything else He supposedly changed, Yeshua also did away with a need to be wary of presumption, you could also consider 'Ananias and Sophia' and Herod from the post Yeshua writings. All these incidents might seem trifling to us, just the sort of thing about which we might say 'God wont mind if....' - but look at the response of Adonai.

For the sake of unity, it would be a very good idea if we were to ditch the terms 'Old' and 'New' which I believe were coined by the heretic Marcion in about 140 AD . As I understand it, Marcion coined the terms "Old and New Testament" to effectively differentiate between YHWH - who he saw as Bad and Yeshua - who he saw as Good and to make them two separate, and incompatible entities. This has subsequently caused the dualism in Christian churches that use the terms Old and New Testament to uphold replacement and dispensational theology. Far better would it be if we could instead get an understanding that the scriptures as a whole provide an ongoing picture of Adonai's continuing salvation story for Isra'el first, but also for the Gentile.

Hopefully, this overview might go someway to answering why some of us do see All scripture to be equally important, why we don't regard any of it as 'Old' or 'New'. In choosing to follow all YHWH's commands, we are just doing what Yeshua told us we should do.

This is, of course, one of many New Testament commands - there is no avoiding it by shouting legalism, there are commands to be obeyed throughout the whole of the scriptures.

Shalom

David

"Because the old wine is Bes"

No, let us not be arrogant - but let us not have false humility either, for in Christ alone shall we boast. If we were not on the original guest list, why was the coming of Christ prophesied in the Old Testament if Our Creator God had not known that a desperate measure was going to be needed to bring His Word into the world ? By the Grace of God alone, I have been grafted into a people, not a piece of land and it is a church which Our Lord is growing which holds us all, Jew and Gentile alike. I don't see arrogance. I see a people desperate for the the Divine Love of God, for Truth and Peace in our time. Many good churches teach the Bible as one continuing story, with Hebrews being the link between the two. In his book, the "Unlocking the Bible Omnibus", David Pawson calls the first part "The Makers' Instructions" and the second part, beginning with the Gospels, "The Hinge of History". There is no question that Our Father God has not finished his work with the Jews for He has promised them their land,a promise He will keep, but I personally believe we have to go even further back to the very beginning with Adam and Eve to see the answer to the real problem which is the inbalance between man and woman throughout the entire world as against what Our Father Creator intended which is even now infiltrating the English national church. How shamefully we have let Him down, male and female alike. Our Creator has promised the Jews their land, and he will keep his promise, as He has promised that there will be judgement for all, a new Heaven, a new Earth and a new Jerusalem for the faithful.
Peace be with you,
Mustard seed

Re: What it means to be Jewish

First, Jewish is heritage, race and religion.

Second, Not knowing where you are in UK, i found a couple of places, but if you want to give a tad more on your Geography, I can ask around, have friends from London, Manchester, Surrey, Newcastle, Edinburgh, Dublin, etc.
So here's a link to Messianic congregations throughout the UK:
http://www.messianic.org.uk/London.htm

Ta, Darling, hope it helps

Sarah
sarahnonprofit1@yahoo.com

Being Jewish

My mother's family were Greek but of the Jewish faith. My dad's folks were old school Methodist of Weslyan thought. I guess I am a Half Yahude and half Messianic. You can be both, I hope. John